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Author Topic: Aeration of whirlpool hops  (Read 579 times)

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Offline BobbyD

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Aeration of whirlpool hops
« on: March 06, 2018, 04:24:52 PM »
I read an article recently about the importance of minimising the oxidation of dry hop oils post fermentation. The belief was oxidation of the aromatic hop oils reduced that lovely hop aroma. This got me thinking about aeration of our fermenters pre fermentation. For example using a hop back to infuse hop oils into our wort, we chill it and then soon after we aerate it. Wouldn't the same oxidation of the hop oils occur here that brewers are so careful to prevent post fermentation?

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Offline labels

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Re: Aeration of whirlpool hops
« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2018, 07:26:03 PM »
I read an article recently about the importance of minimising the oxidation of dry hop oils post fermentation. The belief was oxidation of the aromatic hop oils reduced that lovely hop aroma. This got me thinking about aeration of our fermenters pre fermentation. For example using a hop back to infuse hop oils into our wort, we chill it and then soon after we aerate it. Wouldn't the same oxidation of the hop oils occur here that brewers are so careful to prevent post fermentation?

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Hi scientist Chris, I can't answer your questions, there is only one true scientist on this forum but I will throw the following into the argument.

Firstly, it depends whether you're information is correct but lets assume it is, it does make sense.
Secondly, you were at the yeast meeting the other week and they stated that the yeast use the oxygen within twelve hours, again assuming correct pitching rates.
So lastly, the question is how long does it take for the hop oils to oxidise. If it's longer than twelve hours for any noticeable oxidation then all is okay but - then we don't know that. That is what you haved to find out.
Just another Adelaide brewer

Offline bookworm1707

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Re: Aeration of whirlpool hops
« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2018, 07:42:52 PM »
My 2c based on internet forum myths, drunken conversations about brewing and various heresy...

There was a thing that went around a while back about hot side aeration, being a bad thing. I believe it was fairly debunked. Not sure what it supposedly did but might have been to do with hop oils, maybe worth a look and see if that is what your information is based on?

There is conversation about locking in hop flavour. How to do it, what to avoid etc. I know if I was super concerned it would be Doomed i would talk to. He has more than a casual interest in hops... But if they are 'locked in' at some point then it might be the case that the aeration at the start of fermentation wouldn't be an issue? Kieren has probably played around with this.

Can you also post the article? A screen shot? Link?

No answers, sorry! Ha!

Offline labels

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Re: Aeration of whirlpool hops
« Reply #3 on: March 06, 2018, 07:53:53 PM »
Hot side aeration has nothing to do with hops because it's a mash related issue.

It has also not been completely debunked. It's gone from being a huge concern through to being absolute garbage - no such thing, and has recently been ressurected as 'there might be something in this'
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Offline cronessa

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Re: Aeration of whirlpool hops
« Reply #4 on: March 07, 2018, 06:48:17 AM »
Scientist Chris?

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Offline Leprechaun

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Re: Aeration of whirlpool hops
« Reply #5 on: March 07, 2018, 07:53:30 AM »
You just got a job promotion bud!

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Offline BobbyD

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Re: Aeration of whirlpool hops
« Reply #6 on: March 07, 2018, 11:30:14 AM »
Thanks all. I will post a pic of the article when I get home tonight.
Good suggestions Steve. I was thinking along the same lines.

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Offline labels

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Re: Aeration of whirlpool hops
« Reply #7 on: March 07, 2018, 11:51:37 AM »
Scientist Chris?

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Yep, should have been scientist Luke
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Re: Aeration of whirlpool hops
« Reply #8 on: March 07, 2018, 01:04:42 PM »
As Labels has said, oxygen is taken up pretty quick by the yeast, I've read as quickly as a couple of hours. You'll be fine as long as you're oxygenating and pitching yeast straight away and not oxygenating then perhaps letting it sit and waiting for it to come down to pitching temp.  Considering it is standard practice to oxygenate wort prior to pitching yeast in commercial breweries it certainly should be fine at our scale.

Offline BobbyD

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Re: Aeration of whirlpool hops
« Reply #9 on: March 08, 2018, 09:31:33 AM »
As promised, the article is from the BYO magazine and is called Advanced Dry Hopping O2 Know thy enemy.
What I have taken away from the discussion thus far is during summer my wort temp post chill is high twenties. I then put my fermenter in the fridge to cool down to low 20s before pitching. Now..... since I use the splashing technique to aerate my wort then it is allowing the oxygen to oxidise my wort instead of my yeast (it will take several hours on fridge to reach low 20s). So really I should either pitch straight away or remove the splashing and wait till pitching to aerate.

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Offline NigeP62

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Re: Aeration of whirlpool hops
« Reply #10 on: March 08, 2018, 09:47:56 AM »
I might be missing something but that article has nothing to do with oxidising hop oils.
More about the introduction of oxygen post ferment which is a well known issue.
Pre ferment oxygen good, post ferment bad.
The article points to different ways oxygen may be introduced to a beer and suggests a few ways to minimise it.
Post ferment oxygen reduces shelf life which is a major issue in commercial product.
I don't see sitting a fermenter in the fridge to cool to ferment temp to be an issue as long as good sanitary techniques are followed. More chance of spoilage organisms getting a foothold prior to yeast consuming the available o2.
In my case in summer I transfer via chiller without splashing, chill the last few degrees in the fridge then aerate and pitch.

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Re: Aeration of whirlpool hops
« Reply #11 on: March 08, 2018, 10:00:02 AM »
I oxygenate about one hour after pitching. I also pitch warm straight out of the chiller - usually about 25C, lagers and ales. After oxygenating I place into controlled temperature environment.
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Offline DrSmurto

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Re: Aeration of whirlpool hops
« Reply #12 on: March 08, 2018, 10:48:09 AM »
I might be missing something but that article has nothing to do with oxidising hop oils.
More about the introduction of oxygen post ferment which is a well known issue.
Pre ferment oxygen good, post ferment bad.
The article points to different ways oxygen may be introduced to a beer and suggests a few ways to minimise it.
Post ferment oxygen reduces shelf life which is a major issue in commercial product.
I don't see sitting a fermenter in the fridge to cool to ferment temp to be an issue as long as good sanitary techniques are followed. More chance of spoilage organisms getting a foothold prior to yeast consuming the available o2.
In my case in summer I transfer via chiller without splashing, chill the last few degrees in the fridge then aerate and pitch.

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My thoughts also. I was interested in seeing an article about oxygen during wort production. Post fermentation is well known.

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Offline BobbyD

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Re: Aeration of whirlpool hops
« Reply #13 on: March 11, 2018, 06:29:43 PM »
You guys are killing me. Next time read the OP. I was pretty clear. Article about post fermentation oxidisation of dry hop oils.


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Offline NigeP62

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Re: Aeration of whirlpool hops
« Reply #14 on: March 11, 2018, 06:55:40 PM »
You guys are killing me. Next time read the OP. I was pretty clear. Article about post fermentation oxidisation of dry hop oils.


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Sorry Bobby but the article is about introducing O2 while dry hopping not oxidisation of hop oils as far as I can tell.

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